I am really curious to hear from someone from an engineering standpoint on this. Nitrous oxide...the magical ingredient in this potion that is ever so desired is oxygen gas. N2O has more oxygen content than the air we breath so hence forth gas burns faster, bigger explosion...whatever. Why do we not use pure oxygen instead? Instead of N2O which has a percentage of oxygen content just go ***** out and get 100% and get even more power...maybe 50, 60% more.

I understand that there are heat issues; oxygen burns MUCH hotter then N2O and I am assuming much quicker. If it gets hotter why cant a lower temp thermostat be ran so the coolant flows through longer, put better rings on the pistons, have better head gaskets and seals?

I am probably just being silly about this and I know there are some repercussions about trying to do such a thing. At the same time though...why not.

Another thought I was pondering about (this probably belongs in a different section however I want tominimize my silly threads) is cooling the intake.

Cold air is denser then hot therefore more air can be forced in hence bigger combustion, etc.
Why is there not an intake witha cooling "collar" on it. Some sort of coolant can flow through it and cool the air going through. Now the problems I see are the air is moving extremely fast through the intake so the coolant needs to be COLD to be able to make any sort of difference. What if liquid nitrogen was used in this collar?

The intake would have to be very strong and dense and able to handle hot and cold flashes (think intake and intake manifold on menopause). However if there was a certain alloy that could handle this I do not see why it would not work. People have systems that spray N2O on their intercoolers to increase power (because it cools the air even further than the intercooler alone). Liquid nitrogen is even colder.

We have to go back to Chemistry class and remember about Enthelpy (SP?). The basis of this occurance ishow the matter (air in this case) changes temperature based on the container (intake or intake manifold) retaining or expelling the temperature it has.

In a nutshell as to where I am trying to get, we would need to make the air cold enough to not only make a differnce in the engine but do not forget it has to travel through a lot of warm engine parts to get there. Cooling the air 10 degrees would make no difference (or very little) by the time it got to the combustion chamber because it would have heated up again from the intake manifold or runners.

Hmmm...oh well. Please tell me what you think. I am just trying to have a little fun with this and want to see what other people have to say!

 

lol... Super Nitrous Oxide, when Nitrous Oxide just isn't enough.

I don't really get what you are trying to ask in the rest of your post but you use nitrous instead of oxygen because it cools the intake and it is inert until it is heated up. (Not going to blow up when it is freezing, they way it is kept in the bottle) Nitrous can only react with fuel after it has been heated up for several hundred degrees then it breaks down into nitrogen and oxygen molecules then the oxygen molecules are free to react with the fuel and ignite.

I think I do get what you are saying about running sleeves around the intake and running coolant through it but think about it, the intake manifold is still colder than the coolant you are trying to run through it. You would be heating up the intake with it not cooling it down.

 

I did not know that the nitrous oxide needed to heat up...a silly thread is learning me something over here yah!

I would think the intake manifold would be heating the air up...if your car is running for a while and you grab a hold of it...its going to be hot. I know its not the air heating it up more over the fact that it is attached to the head which is connected to the block and all that good stuff is hot.

If you used something crazy cold like liquid nitrogen that is some 200 degrees below zero(I think?)...there isnt much colder out there then that...especially something that can be contained in a bottle...in your trunk =)

So...having something that could circulate around the intake and intake manifold (what I meant by collar (something that will obviously not obstruct the air flow, just wrap around the components)) to chill or darn near freeze the air to make it colder.

Furthermore I was also talking about instead of injecting the car with Nitrous Oxide to inject it with O2...

Again, my hypothetical questions and thoughts are outlandish and I am sure not feasible but I was just curious to find out what someone with a lot more knowledge than I have about this subject would have to say about this.


I have asked others about this and I can never get an educated answer as to why this would not work. I feel like I fully do not understand things until I knowwhat is right (and why) what is wrong (and why).


Oh...and you need a catchy title to get people to open and read! =)

 

Well I get what you mean about cooling the intake but it really wouldn't help much. You are correct that the intake manifold gets hot because it it connected to the head though. Think about it though, you couldn't use coolant. After you are at operation temp you can still hold your hand on the intake manifold, but the coolant is too hot. Coolant would heat the intake further, not cool it down. Liquid nitrogen would probably crack the manifold and even if it would work. Think about that, it is winter now, air is freezing. Do you see a big hp gain? Driving in the cold would achieve the same thing you are trying to do with cooling the intake. Not worth it. You need the nitrous inside the engine so there is more oxygen to burn more fuel to make more power. The horsepower comes from the fuel, not the nitrous. Nitrous just allows you to burn more fuel.

 

All very true...was just thinking. I am very bored at work some days and have a whole bunch of ideas in my head. I have seen many people at tracks packing their intakes and manifolds with bags of ice (assuming trying to achieve what my logic was). I wanted to bounce the idea off some people to maybe come up with a more suitable solution. Maybe something everyone could benefit from. I dream more then live in reality sometimes. =)

 

I think what he is getting at is basically how can you cool your intake in the most dramatic way possible to create the most power? It is true that the cooler your intake charge the more power you can safely make. Mobsta mentioned driving in cool weather is basically creating a cooler charge and yes you might not notice much of a gain in power but if its 30* ouside as opposed to 90* you can run Probably 13-14psi of boost at the same safety level as you could run 10psi in 90* weather. Your ambient air temps will be 60* lower, hence 60* lower ambient air cooling your intercooler which increases your intercooler efficiency by a drastic percent which essentially lowers your intake charge considerably. This is basically what spraying your intercooler with n2o achieves but in a less drastic way. By lowering the intake charge you reduce your risk of detonation. The book "Maximum Boost" covers all this stuff in great detail.

I think pure o2 has certain properties that dont make for a good addative in combustion but it is an interesting thought. Look into water-to-air intercoolers. Those have some pretty crazy intercooler efficiency ratings especially when ran for short periods of time filled with ice water. The hardest thing about a cooling system for charge air is having it readily available for more than a few seconds at a time and having it not cost a fortune for what its worth. Cool discussion though and Im glad to see a post other than "Is this a good turbo?"

 

Cryo2 + Nitrous = Super Nitrous???

 

what is cryO2?

 

It is used in turbo/intercooler applications in the same way nitrous oxide is. IIRC is it co2 sprayed onto the intercooler instead of nitrous. Works the same way. And yes, I am glad to see this thread instead of another "can I put a bov on my n/a car" thread or "which header/intake is best" or my favorite: "Ibeplanning on turbozing my whip, any1wana helpa me tell m3 w@t is best turbo kit? LOLZ?!"

 

Is IIRC cheaper then nitrous? I have never heard of this before so now Im really curious about learning more about it. Why would one chose to use it vs. another?