I have a 2005 Civic EX. It only has 59,000 miles. Last August the brake calipers were sticking so I ordered some new parts online from autopartswarehouse.com. I decided to just replace the calipers, brake pads & rotors so everything would be all new. I think the calipers were factory reconditioned though so I don't know how reliable that usually is to get done.

Anyway, shortly after I had the parts installed I started getting some minor sticking again on the calipers but it wasn't bad. Last week they locked up on me during the rush hour in DC traffic. It was so bad I couldn't go more than 5 mph with the gas floored. I was finally able to get off the road and get the jarred loose after a few minutes and made it home.

Today I dropped it off at Midas for a free brake inspection & told them I had some problems with the calipers locking up on me even though they were only 6-7 months old. They gave me a free inspection & concluded that my entire brake system was contaminated and would cost nearly $4000 to fix! The car is worth $8-9K on a good day so this is not good news.

Their entire diagnosis was based on the rubber seal inside the cap of the master cylinder is swollen. It seemed to be about 20% bigger than what it should be and wouldn't go back on after he took it off. He basically had to just jam it back in there. Based on this in combination with my relatively new calipers going bad he thinks the entire system is contaminated and we should replaced all parts that have any rubber in them.

He wants to replace the Brake Calipers, 2 rear wheel cylinders, the master cylinder, the front brake hoses, rear brake hoses, brake flush and possibly the ABS pump could be contaminated. That one apparently costs $2300 if it's bad. Since everything besides the master cylinder seal was internal they didn't actually see if those pieces were bad but just made the assumption. $4000 is a pretty steep price based on a guess.

Has anyone had this happen to them or seen something similar? If this was contaminated how would something like this happen? Would someone topping off the fluid using the wrong type during an oil change something that may have caused this? I was hoping a new gasket & some wd40 would do the trick but maybe he's right and I should drop $4k. What do you guys think?

 

IMHO, take it to a different shop, don't tell them about the previous estimate/diagnostic and let them come up with their recommendations.

If the system is contaminated, maybe bleed the brake lines and refill is sufficient. Replace any parts that damaged. I can't see how a complete brake system replacement would cost what you were quoted.

 

in that 4000 dollars better include a big brake kit and stainless steel braided lines or soemthing lol.. i cant see it costing that much either

 

Remove & Replace Front Brake Calipers $90 labor & $295 Parts.
Remove & replace 2 rear wheel cylinders $90 labor & $66 Parts.
Brake Flush $80.
Remove & Replace Master Cylinder $90 labor & $267 Parts.
Replace Front Brake Hoses $90 labor & $95 parts.
ABS Pump could possibly also be damaged from contamination of brake fluid (replace pump) $90 labor & $2280 part.
R&R Rear brake hoses $72 labor & $124 parts.

Total with tax is $3,946.24.

 

Contamination will ruin the whole system, like the first guy said any part with rubber in it. That would include the ABS pump. If you don't get all the contaminant out by flushiing and replacing everything it will just destroy rubber parts again. The ABS pump has a reservoir of brake fluid under pressure, which is now contaminated.

If you've been going to an oil change place and someone has been topping up your fluids you need to complain to them because that's how it happens. Putting any substance other than brake fluid in the reservoir does indeed lead to a 4 figure repair bill.

Drain some brake fluid out and put it in a clean clear glass jar. If contaminated, it will often separate into two layers-- the brake fluid and the something else. It can also be sent off for a more scientific analysis.

 

Calipers- $84
Wheel cylinders- $26
Brake fluid- $10
Master cylinder- $105
Brake lines- $70

All off of Advanced Auto Parts website. $295+ tax vs $927 from the list you gave.

As for the ABS pump, from www.hondapartsdeals.com, $835 vs $2280.

Labor rate will generally be the same at most places. What you were quoted on labor is about $522. So if you buy re-manufactured parts and buy the ABS pump elsewhere, you could potentially have this done for ~$1800. Still a big chunk of change but much less than buying parts through the shop.

 

I just got back from my local Honda dealership & they confirmed that the system was contaminated. Like Midas, they based it on the swollen rubber piece in the master cylinder. Surprisingly, the parts & labor were substantially cheaper there than Midas. Honda wanted $1667.12 for parts and about $1200 for labor. I would have never guessed it would be $1200 less than Midas since dealerships usually charge the most.

Anyway, I am going to take the advice of Civicexracer and get all the parts at Hondapartsdeals.com and Advanced Auto Parts. My parts should be around $1,130 instead of $1,667 at the dealer. I wonder why Midas charges $2,280 for the ABS Modulator assembly when even getting it directly from Honda is only $1142? That wasn't even including the labor to install it.

Now I need a little advice on the installation if someone would be able to help me out here. I previously installed the Rotors, pads & calipers on the front so that shouldn't be a problem. The rear cylinders should not be much of an issue. I'm a little confused as to the order of replacement, fluid draining & flushing though.

Is it relatively easy to replace the master cylinder, ABS modulator & the front/rear hoses?

At what point do I drain the lines that have the contaminated fluid? Do I drain first, then replace the parts?

Should I flush it a few times then replace the parts & then maybe flush it again?

Is there any kind of machine I could buy to help flush the lines that's relatively inexpensive?

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks.

 

Take all the contaminated parts off first and put aside (throw away ones that have no core value). Naturally the fluid will drain out as part of this process. The only hydraulic brake system parts left on the car should then be the metal lines. Flush each line with spray brake cleaner (non chlorinated type) and follow with lots of dry compressed air (pass it through a filter like would be used for spraying paint). Install new parts and fill with new fluid and bleed the system.

 

Midas probably gets it from another distributor and they might be selling the entire assembly/parts with it. Not to mention they might mark it up too.

As for order of things, I'm unsure because of the ABS module as I've never delt with flushing a system with an ABS module. Try picking up a Haynes manual if you don already have one.

The master cylinder, wheel cylinders, and lines are pretty easy to do. You'll want to use line wrenchs on the mater cylinder and lines. You can strip the nuts if you use a normal open end wrench. You might be able to rent a brake bleeder from the parts store. That would make things easier and speed up the process.

 

The mechanics are assuming everything in the brake system is contaminated. I don't have any system lights coming on & nobody has checked the ABS system to be certain. I would love to avoid the $850 hit if possible.

How can I find out if it is really contaminated?

Can it be flushed or cleaned along with replacing all the other parts?

If the ABS modulator was cleaned would it still be able to contaminate the brake line system again if I don't replace it?

Thanks.